Operation Silence - Final Showdown
An old man cries for his son trapped inside the Jamia Hafsa Complex - Photo Credit :AP
Ghazi Abdur Rasheed, Deputy Cleric Of Lal Masjid Killed in Crossfire.According to the latest information, Abdur Rasheed Ghazi, who was leading the militant resistance from within the Lal Masjid after the capture of his brother Abdul Aziz, has been killed in cross fire. He was asked to surrender out of his bunker after being hit in the leg, but he could not come out after 4 hours of siege of his bunker. Later he was killed in exchange of fire.
Tags: Lal Masjid , Islamabad, Islamabad Seige, Jameya Hafsa, Jameya Fareedia, Lal Masjid Seige
First Reports
Talks between the government and Lal masjid have failed. The religous leaders from the government side came back dissappointed, and shut off their mobiles. Final operation given a go ahead. Operation started at 4.30 am, after a government’s press conference. Severe fighting going on since 4:45 am. Commandoes have entered the complex. More than 70 big explosions. 2 ellite force officers dead. 8 severely injured. The whole of Islamabad is rocking with mega explosions, and intense firing. More than 30 ambulances deployed and in action. According to the reports by Ghazi Abdul-ur-Rasheed his mother died during the assault. A significant number of dead bodies inside the complex. According to the military spokesman, the millitants are using rocket launchers, gernades, and heavy arms. Meanwhile when the operation started, 20 children were safely recovered. DG ISPR has reported that the operation will be completed in 3 hours, and currently militants are present in the basement of the complex. Some militants are showing resistance from the top of the complex. Clouds of heavy smoke rising from the complex. Islamabad has been sealed off from all directions so people comming to the capital from outside should take appropriate measures.
Latest!-11th July 01:30 PM
Reports from last night indicate 3 more militants were killed in exchange of fire, and another secuirty force official was also killed in cross fire. Operation is almost complete, with the clean up second phase already in progress in some parts of the complex. Media personal are told to be taken into the complex sometime later in the afternoon. According to government officials all illegal structures in the Lal Masjid compound which were established on illegally occupied state land would be demolished after the operation is complete. Meanwhile the city is slowly returning back to routine life, however at this time there were no confrimed reports of relaxation in curfew in the affected areas of G-6 sector where the complex is situated. Citizens are advised to take caution travelling in eastern parts of Bluearea, and sectors G-7 and G-5.
Latest!-10th July 11:00 PM
Ghazi Abdur Rasheed’s body has been taken out of the Jamia Hafsa Complex. Meanwhile three loud explosions have been heard from Lal Masjid over here. Operation still going on. Bodies being sent to I-8 morge. Reports of taking media to have a round of Lal masjid complex tomorrow. Musharraf will address the nation tomorrow evening.
Latest!-10th July 08:45 PM
Islamabad is under red alert and a sensitive security zone right now. Security forces are on a look out for mysterious figures, and spot checking being done on any suspicous people. Military forces are securing different sectors for fear of any possible repurcussion and backlash of this event as riots have already broken out in other parts of the country including Swat and Kohistan area. Meanwhile operation still going on in Lal Masjid against hand full of militants who are showing resistance. Once the area has been cleared and sanatized, cleaning forces would move in to secure the area. Reports confirm cousins of Ghazi’ have also been killed in the operation. Ghazi’s aunts and sisters have requested the government official to hand over ghazi’s body to the relatives for proper burial. Security personals are doing spot checks for any suspicious people. Residents of G-6,-G-7,-Bluearea,F-6,F-7 and Diplomatic enclave are advised to take appropriate caution while travelling.
Latest!-10th July 06:45 PM
Ghazi Abdur Rasheed, Deputy Cleric Of Lal Masjid Killed in Crossfire. According to the latest information, Abdur Rasheed Ghazi, who was leading the militant resistance from within the Lal Masjid after the capture of his brother Abdul Aziz, has been killed in cross fire. He was asked to surrender out of his bunker after being hit in the leg, but he could not come out after 4 hours of siege of his bunker. Later he was killed in exchange of fire. His body is still inside the facility and has not been recovered yet. Security forces are continuing operations in other part of the area and trying to free any additional hostages.
10th July 06:15 PM
Members of delgation of religious scholars who were in negotiations with the Lal Masjid administration have blamed the government for taking a U turn on negotiations. According to them the final draft of resolution was agreed on by all parties including senior government officials. However when it was taken to the president house for approval by Chaudary Shujhat, he came back with a totally different copy of the draft with resulted in fall out and bycot by the religious scholars and the Lal Masjid Administration.
10th July 04:15 PM
According to latest reports, security officials are trying to break into the main hall where Ghazi Abdur Rasheed is supposedly present. Despite earlier calls by the security personal to drop their weapons and come out in the open. no one has responded from the hall. There are concerns that the whole hall is bobby trapped and security personals’ break in could trigger explosives and bring down the entire structure. Meanwhile there are reports of investigation being done from the women who have recently been brought out of the complex about the nature of explosives set up in the remaining area as well as possible hostages in the compund to have sufficent information before taking any actions. Security forces have also restricted access of public to the eastern part of blue area.
10th July 02:45 PM
According to a telephonic interview given to some foriegn journalist by one of the occupants of Lal Masjid, Ghazi Abdur Rasheed is still alive inside the complex and is particpating in leading the command of resistance from the southern section of the complex. It’s the peak of summer season this time around the year here in Islamabad, and the weather of Islamabad is extreemly hot right now with a hot breeze blowing. It’s the middle of the afternoon and temperature is approximately in the mid 40 degrees centigrade. The children and women inside the complex have been facing heavy tear gas shelling, power cuts, water supply cuts, and traumatizing loud explosions. They have already seen non stop graphic stream of events of death and destruction for over 10 hours now.
10th July 02:00 PM
Latest unconfirmed reports on the women freed from the complex disclose that among the women who have been brought out of the complex alive include the lady principal of Lal masjid, and wife of Abdul Aziz Ume Hassan, and her daughter Isma.
10th July 01:30 PM
A new update from official sources put the security personal death toll to 8 which includes one captain from the SSG force. In the meanwhile around 24 burqa clad women with 20+ children managed to escape the complex. The operation is now going on in the southern section of the complex. The whole area is under heavy tear gas shelling by security forces, and around 12000 security forces including SSG, Army, and Police have been deployed. A further clarification has been provided by the officials that no nerve gas was used during the operation and stun gernades were used. Also contrary to the earlier reports on the capture of Ghazi Abur Rasheed, he is still at large somewhere inside the complex
10th July 11:15 AM
According to the latest updates 7 additional security personel are dead which include 2 captains from the army SSG and one senior official of ellite force. This brings the security personal death toll to 13. Earlier several more militants have surrendered, while siege of underground bunkers continues.
10th July 9:45 AM
The operation has moved into its final phase where security forces have seiged the hardcore militants in the basements, where they are probably keeping the hostage women and children. Heavy explosions followed by sporadic firing being heard from the area. These could either be explosives being set off by the security forces or the possible land mines which were feared to have been planted throughout the complex.
10th July 9:30 AM
Reserve doctors and apprentice are being taken to Lal Masjid. It seems that a major portion of the complex has been secured for deployment of medical personal.
10th July 9:15 AM
Few more explosions heard at Lal Masjid from where I am
10th July 8:45 AM
Total of 6 security personal have died in the operation according to the reports from the hospital. DG ARMY ISPR would be holding a press conference shortly. According to official reports, a total 40 militants have been killed. 24 people were arrested fleeing from the complex. Operation still going on to clear the basements. There is so far no news about the condition of the hostages.
10th July 8:20 AM
Maximum area of Jamia Hafsa secured according to unofficial reports. Lal Masjid being searched by commandoes. According to unconfirmed reports, Ghazi Abdur Rasheed has been arrested.
10th July 8:15 AM
After over 4 hours of 150 explosions and intense firing from both sides, there is silence around the vicinity of Lal Masjid. Looks like the operation has stopped, and army is making announcements on loud speakers for militants to come out with hands up. The top levels of Jamia Hafsa have been cleared. Only bunkers and basements remain where the militants have retreated.
10th July 8:00 AM
Situation critical in PIMS and Poly Clinic. Normal patient relatives pushed out. Media people not allowed to enter the hospitals. Police pushing the media out of the hospital and are announcing that they have orders to shoot on sight if anyone tries to enter the hospital.
10th July 7:50 AM
According to the latest update by the military spokesman, 60% of the complex has been cleared. Ghazi Rasheed managed to get in touch with a local television reporting he could see commandoes in the vicinity and then his line disconnected. Army is announcing that those people who want to come out of the complex can come out of the complex with their hands up. There are still women children , and non militant men trapped in the complex. I can hear sporadic fire from where I am.
10th July 7:30 AM
Firing has subsided a lot, which could probably mean that security forces have essentially taken over a major portion of the complex. Operation probably has moved into it’s final phases. Media persons not allowed near the quardent off site, and security personal have been oredered to shoot them on sight. Media people not allowed near the hospitals too. Scout helicopters flying over the complex.
10th July 7:20 AM
3 special forces personal die. 20 militants casualties. 15 militants injured. Nerve gas used in the basement. Firing has reduced a somewhat probably due to casualities within the complex. 40% of the complex under security forces control. A significant portion of the complex was bobby trapped according to the army spokesman.
10th July 7:15 AM
Comandoes enter the basement!. The top of complex has been cleared. 10 big buses dispatched towards Lal Masjid. Intense shelling of tear gas and firing continues and rounds of automatic weapons can be heard from here. Ghazi Rasheed says he will fight till martyrdom. Security forces dead bodies being rushed to PIMS. 50 people arrested from the complex till now. Residents of G-6 advised not to leave their homes. 70 resistants killed or injured in the operation so far.
10th July 7:00 AM
A part of Lal masjid on fire!! Black smoke rising from the complex. Intense fighting going on, and severe resistance from the militants.
Related posts:
State terrorism. Period.
Terrorist mullahs should be eliminated.
no commoent both are at mistake first let them grow now they want to kill them..
Please, all sides of this issue were foolish. The emotions are high, but lives are still at stake. Pray for them all.
Update from Reuters
http://in.today.reuters.com/news/NewsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2007-07-10T071300Z_01_NOOTR_RTRMDNC_0_India-283668-28.xml
@Hamid..
How frikkin’ naive you sound. Period.
Backpacker, you are doing great. Thanks
@ Hamid. How stupid you can get. Period.
You would be well advised to understand the meaning of the term “State Terrorism”.
Use of force to eject criminals who have taken innocents hostages is not considered State Terrorism. Especially if we look at the history of the entire process over the course of past months, it would be overly naive to characterize it “State Terrorism”.
Are people not paying attention to the fact that the militants are using automatic weapons? They have themselves admitted to possessing Klashnikov assault rifles.
Let’s not kid ourselves. I think those people who are using these terms casually would think very differently if their own child or brother would have been shot by one of these criminals.
@exciton, no amount of arguments will affect these people. The logic is so simple in this case that it is even unthinkable that one has to make an argument here. Its like 2+2=4. So no point in talking to them. Its not about any ideology, conservative, liberal , progrssive or whatever. Its about law and order and if there should be something called law on this land or it should be 1870’s wild west.
How annoyingly unprofessional is the media. The guy just gives the host an information and he asks him to repeat it right away. and then repeat it again. And to top that he does the same with the DG ISPR and asks him to repeat himself right after he has said something , (like he was lying or may change his statement on reconsideration) as if he is also one of his reporters.
Time to see just how much they want their martyrdom. If any surrender we shall see the answer.
You state at 720 am that nerve gas was used.
Would that be an organophosphate based compound?
Yikes, a bit harsh about the PIMS rule. Why should they shoot civilians on sight who attempt to enter the hospital? That sounds quite retarded.
This sound like a an attack on a military base rather than a mosque.
No need to follow your stupid blog…for live updates visit http://www.jumptv.com/en/channel/aajtv/
Thank you Backpacker. I wish you could know how much your doing this eases my heart concerning this terrible mess.
Terrorising hundreds of innocents (minus the militants) is considered terrorism according to all international conventions. The military since day one has not differentiated between the innocents and the militants. This is state terrorism. Stupid.
Don’t be so naive people. You are brain-washed by the zionist-pakistani media.
Carry on,Backpacker……you are doing a great job. We are worried sitting so far away and news channels are lagging way behind on updates. My prayers are with the innocent women and children and the army jawan.
MUSH is taking Pakistan towards IRAQ.
I pray for “ZILLAT AMEZ” zindagee for the MUNAFIQEEEN and even worse death for them, AMEEEN.
For the love of God, zionist-pakistani media! I wonder when this phrase entered our collective psyche!
This should have been done the first instance without a 2nd thought. Yes after a major number of people were rescued or moved out, the operation should have started there and then and that too from air rather than using the SSG. Is there life too in expensive… Flat out air attack and take them all out!
hamid? the pakistani media is jewish now? Zionists are people who wish to have a jewish homeland. I didn’t know pakistani media wanted a jewish homeland.
The News: ‘Operation Silence’ silent now
Updated at 0845 PST
ISLAMABAD: The operation against Lal Masjid is put on pause for over 35 now. The toxic nerve gas is being thrown into the premises
….
I thought nerve gas was banned by international law?
This is state terrorism in its purest form. Pakistan has become an evil state.
Mualana agreed for a judicial inquiry, the conversations should not have ended this way. I can see how a mysteries group in government sabotaged the dialogue and opted for an operation.
backpacker, i honestly appreciate your efforts. Thanks a lot.
Maulana should be be shot to death, seriously. Khatam kero saara qissa!!
This kissa was very unfortunate and should have never happened. Law and Order does not exist as it should in this country. What will we do to make sure that such a kissa is never repeated?
@JK: Are you dumb? What is your definition of Zionism? It is not simply a bunch of people wanting a jewish homeland. Do some basic research before commenting. Anyway … do you want proof of the zionist influence on Pakistan media?
Here, Zionist-Jew Peter Huellen conducts “workshop” in Pakistan to “to sensitize the students (especially for the students involved in Radio) with the trends in news making and feature writing for the Radio”: http://lahore.metblogs.com/archives/2007/07/media_workshop.phtml
Peter Hullen conducting a similar “workshop”, as posted by the Uzbekistan Embassy in ISRAEL: http://www.embuzisr.mfa.uz/print.php?sid=657
Do you need more proof? or will this suffice?
Terrorist mullahs silenced!!! What happended to hallow slogans of “suicide-bombings”, “country-wide uprisings”, “heavy casualities to the army” etc. It appears that slogans from the pulpit were just taht: slogans. Not different from fatwas delivered off the cuff. For once, the military has made us proud. They have set the ball rolling - mullah terrorists throughout the country will now have to hide in caves a la one OBL.
Two openly public workshops are proof of a vast pakistani media conspiracy? I thought these things were supposed to be a bit more secretive.
Hamid, please share with us your theory so we may also be enlightened with what you already know.
KHITE - I agree with your suggestion re: the mullah arrested from his hole.
Peter Hullen is a German, he writes for one of the most popular papers in Germany, how does that make him a zionist?
I think there was someone, like his older brother, who has been boasting that he will die rather than get caught alive.
lols at zionist media. Taraqi karo ge bhai tum. So you claim that pakistan is an evil state. That means you should be up in arms to wage jihad agianst Pakistan. What traitors we have inside our country.
By the way when are you going to give up this key board and take up the arms?
I hope they drop some free food and drinks for the residents of G-6.
At long last this standoff is coming to an end, at least that much is good. Its very sad that it came down to a armed conflict and the death and destruction that always accompanies the use of arms. I would bet that it was not ‘nerve gas’, almost certainly ‘tear gas’.
I pray that in the coming weeks, months, and years, peace will be with you Pakistan.
@Hamid, what would you have the government do? Thousands representing the radical beliefs of an increasingly militant minority begin asserting control over the capital city and its occupants. They are armed and begin to use those arms. Imo, the govnt acted in defense of its citizens and in its own defense. Ask yourself, why had the brothers armed themselves, and if left unchecked, what would have happened? Perhaps you would prefer the sort of tyrancical rule they would impose if given the chance. Most of your country men would not.
No one captured should be shot. This is not the purpose, is counter productive and against human rights. And anyways it serves their purpose. Specialy I am hoping that rasheed will be caught alive. He should not be termed shaheed by anybody.
Yes, Backpacker, they are vich! I mean they are in and they have secured the top floors. Injured are being medivac’d to CMH, Rwp and Polyclinic, Blue Area.
Go Go Commandoes!
@Michael, you have no clue about the pakistani govt. do you? They are a bunch of cold-blooded killers. I don’t want to waste my time in explaining you.
@Thaos, you don’t seem to undestand how undercover zionist influence tactics work hence no point in trying to convince you.
Anyone on this blog, in the media or in the streets of pakistan does not differentiate between the militants and overwhelming amount of innocents who were killed in this murderous operation is a supporter of state terrorism much like the supporters of bush and blair in regards to iraq. Sit down and contemplate on my last statement and see where you stand.
Apparently the last of the ‘braves’ are holed up in the basement with the women and children (as human shields of course). These people have lost the right to call themselves Muslims.
@Mariam: Who taught this human shields ka nara?
@ Hamid, What makes you think they are not differentiating between women, children and the terrorists? Do you have any proof? Did they use airplanes? Why did they send the commandoes inside to risk their life? There is no proof behind your rhetoric. The responsibility lies with the terrorists not with the government.
I refuse to get into this conspiracy theory with you ,Hamid. No one side is perfect and you can carry on blasting the govt after this crisis has passed but at this point in time, the greater evil was these hooligans terrorizing MY city and my friends and family with their version of how we should live our lives. For once, be a Pakistani and a proud Pakistani and not humiliate your own army in front of the whole world to see.
@ Hamid, This phenomenon of human shielding has existed always. I know where you going. You will say it is coined by Americans/Zionist hence this phenomenon doesnt exist in the world. Wouldnt hurt you if you have some study of history.
And just to clarify, for all I care, you can go and screw America and Israel as much as you want, but this screwing of Pakistan by the Mullahs must be stopped.
Speakng as humbly as I can manage, Ahmed:
that is our goal, too. Are you not tossing out friends, in the long run….?
@Hamid, I know what i’ve observed, in media reports and blogs and such, over the last several months watching the tension grow around Lal Masjid. With regard to this situation, I think the Pakistani government has conducted itself reasonably well, specifically showing concern for the innocents caught in the middle.
And I do distinguish between the two groups you mention. In my view, the innocents were recklessly put in harms way and kept there by the militants. When faced with an overwhelming force that they had provoked, they did not send the innocents amoung them out to safety despite ample opportunity. That is why I said “it is very sad”, the bloodshed of the innocent.
What would you have the government do in this case? If you were king, what would you have done differently, not 5 or 10 or 20 years ago, but in recent history?
@ Ahmed : You are absolutely right……lets focus on the current situation even though it is sadly ingrained in our society that we must criticise and tear our own selves to pieces….we do our enemies work for them. No wonder we have such a bad reputationabroad as we bad mouth ourselves to strangers. Very very depressing. Lets be constructive and patriotic for a change.
@ MA SANDS Thats is called argument building. Because nowadays any thing related to logic here is shot down as simply as saying “American agents” etc etc.
As for the intentions of your government and of our government for that matter, they are not as simple as that, though some good work is done in between, and a lot of bad work (remember Iraq, but lets not turn this space into a totally different debate).
@Hamid/Mariam: Unfortunately, the terminology and logic you use is based on a western understanding of current affairs. This human shields theory is a conspiracy theory your likes have hatched…its not the other way around.
@Michael: I would have accepted Ghazi’s demand for undergoing a transparent trial under the supreme court instead of attacking a place of worship and killing innocents. What is so difficult to understand there?
*@Ahmed/Mariam
Ahmed, thank you. :)
Going to sleep now.
@ Hamid : my comments are based on facts that emerged over the last week….please dont honor me with inventing theories of any sort. Several parents’ interviews clearly show that quite a few students wanted to leave the mosque but were not allowed to. Children in mosque = no attack ….simple logic that the people inside used to their advantage. Further, im here to stay up to date with developements and pray for the safety of the children, women and salaried army jawans, not to lock horns with anyone so please refrain and stick to constructive comments.
@Mariam: What kind of silly logic are you using here? At most — if what you say is true — is a hostage situation and *not* human shields situation. Now you know why I immediately objected to your irresponsible use of this word. Let’s not allow our hatred for the “mullah” and our emotions delude us into misconstruing the reality.
@Mariam: we are doing our enemies job for them by killing our own people. I say way not nuke the whole tribal areas in the best interest of the west, I know your answer would be “yes, why not”.
Maybe its easy for you to be constructive when a mass murder is underway, but for me its time to be as destructive as possible.
@JAYJAY: let me assure you, you’ll soon see the consequences of this mass murder.
MAY ALLAH BLESS US ALL
@ Hamid :Ok, i dont know what technicalities with words youve gotten yourself tangled in but i meant plain and simple hostage situation which is exactly that…using children as a bargaining chip from getting shot….i.e. as shields…human or metal or whatever other form u want…take your pick. Nothing to do with Jews or any other conspiracy theory.Lets keep matter simple. There aint no angels in that basement keeping those children in the line of fire. Human parental instinct would ordinarily tell one to send or get children to safety.
Im tiring of this so please, carry on on your own, no more comments directed at me. Good night
Thanks mush,your frikking policies going to make ghazi a “Shaheed”. I hope you would be getting prepared to deal with tribesmen who were not even controlled by your masters in US as well.
@ Fundementalist : My answer to your question is ‘NO’.
I am saddened at the loss of life in this incident but ultimately it is a question of the rule of law and the greater good. To allow this criminal behavior to accomplish its goals would have only resulted in more of it in the future. It had to come to an end, and it is a tragedy for many families but the alternative would have been many more tragedies for many more families in the future.
May the people of Pakistan find the strength to stand against those who would kidnap and blackmail and threaten and hide behind children.
The civilized world stands with Pakistan today.
There is no telling Abdul Aziz might have shot his own mother…
@George: There is no rule or respect for law in Pakistan so it is quite hypocritical of dictators like Musharraf who sack the chief justice and have no genuine interest for democracy to teach someone a lesson in law. On top of that go against all international conventions of war in going about it. Fine, if he wanted to teach these extremists a lesson, he could have at least done it with decency and with regard of human life. He did not do that and you all are a bunch of puppets going on like a broken record due to your hatred of another group which is causing you to think disfunctionaly.
@ Hamid
“Musharraf who sack the chief justice and have no genuine interest for democracy to teach someone a lesson in law”
So are you saying that because a chief justice was sacked no law in the entire country should be enforced or are you saying that only those who you agree with should go unpunished?
“against all international conventions of war in going about it”
The conventions of war are for the forces of one nation against the forces of another. This was a domestic mass kidnapping and murder case as far as I can tell. The conventions of war do not apply. Or is it a case where they apply when in is convenient for you?
By what authority do you decide which laws should apply and to whom? This is a case of very basic common law in any civilization on the planet. To allow this kind of behavior is to allow he to takes the most children prisoner to be the dictator. I say the people holding the hostages in the mosque were attempting to dictate in this case.
@George: There was no hostage situation. That’s balogne. The government could have avoided the bloodshed but it refused to do so. If you don’t know the details due to your lack of knowledge, it’s better you research up a bit. This is not America where its citizens can rely on their government to take care of them. This is a ruthless dictator killing its own citizens to please his masters, boost his reputation, and for other political reasons.
The US has had it’s own tragic experiences with religious lunatics keeping authorities at bay by holding women and children. The most recent was in Waco, Texas. It is not a phenomenon limited only to Pakistan.
But debates on blogs can sometimes be like trying to converse with a parrot. Goodnight and good luck, Pakistan.
@Hamid: there have been various reports of children and women being freed, including 20 children who were rescued earlier today. If this was not a hostage situation, then I don’t know what is. At this moment, rather than accusing people and pointing fingers, we as a nation should reflect and ponder as to how we got to this sad state of affairs. What the government did might not be right in every person’s opinion, but there should be no doubt in any reasonable person’s mind that the clerics committed horrific and cowardly crimes. It is high time that we learn some lessons from this entire tragedy and try to purge our society from hate crimes and use of violence.
@Hamid
The US has had it’s own tragic experiences with religious lunatics keeping authorities at bay by holding women and children. The most recent was in Waco, Texas. It is not a phenomenon limited only to Pakistan.
But debates on blogs can sometimes be like trying to converse with a parrot. Goodnight and good luck, Pakistan.
There should be an independent inquiry into how this operation was handled by international organizations to set the record straight. I don’t think justice will be served but at least an inquiry (and its results) will not stain the history books with the false information that comes out of the likes of Wahid Arshad Fraud and supporters of terrorist Atlaf Hussain.
According to latest news Ghazi’s mother is dead.But he is still resisting.
Opportunists never seem to go away. Anyways.
“There is no telling Abdul Aziz might have shot his own mother…”
@PHIL: It was evident that you’ll stoop this low.
Altaf group had shown free use of more sophisticated weaponry on may 12th in karachi than Ghazi group, why weren’t they bombarded, I am sure their case would have been different if they had beards and were preacher of Islam.
There is no law in pakistan. period.
@Hamid: I appreciate your efforts keep it brother.
Altaf group had shown free use of more sophisticated weaponry on may 12th in karachi than Ghazi group, why weren’t they bombarded, I am sure their case would have been different if they had beards and were preacher of Islam.
There is no law in pakistan. period.
@Hamid: I appreciate your efforts keep it up brother.
I wanted to make a few observations,
1) Humari fauj ji jawanon ki shakal se manhoosiyat kyoon tapakti hai?
2) This blog is clearly biased in its coverage. So much for citizen journalism. This is ridiculous journalism by a bunch of government stooges.
3) Please refrain from calling the murderer army personnel “shaheed”.
4) Aaj TV is extremely unprofessional.
Thank You and Good Bye.
Hamid > 1) Lal Masjid kay mullay ki shakal se manhoosiyat kyoon tapakti hai?
2) Everything is government operated? Even a blog? How many aluminum foil hats do you own?
3) I respect these poor guys who are basically forced to their deaths because of the circumstances they are born in.
Most people condemn the actions that occured on May 12, including me and it was infact the weakness of the govt. that it failed to catch the culprits in that case. But that wrong action by the govt. doesn’t make the action of these clerics any more righteous. Killing other muslims, destroying govt. property and endangering the lives of innocent people is not part of the Islam that I follow.
@ HAMID
I think you have spread enough hate. You need some rest.
one question comes up is, if someone decides to clean the society based on their moral values, what should be the method?
The circumstances which we Muslims are facing now reminds of a Hadith, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) said “Verily Islam began as a stranger and will someday return as a stranger - therefore give glad tidings to the strangers.”
Hamid people like you, me, Mualana Ghazi and several others are like strangers now and are left alone, but all this should not stop us, not now not ever.
@PK: Don’t lie just for the sake of an argument Mualana Ghazi has a very purnoor face, no doubts.
It would be best if we let ALLAH decide who is Shaheed and who is not.
MAY ALLAH BLESS US ALL
Aah yes, it brings it all back, school days, which as everyone knows are supposed to be the happiest of our lives. You know, cricket pitches and ink blots. A surreptitious smoke in the bike shed, gentle fisticuffs in the playground. Kalashnikov maintenance and bomb making classes, girls happily stitching suicide belts while the boys practise cricket by throwing stones at Chineses masseuses. And the ever present possibility of adolescent romance, the intoxicating sight of an errant eyebrow hair or the uncovered tip of a little toenail, afterall boys will be boys. And then there’s that smell, schools always have a distinctive smell don’t they? I can still smell it now, what does it remind me of? Oh yes, rotting corpses. Yes, my old school, those were the days.
@ JWH; I am still way higher!
@PHIL AHH… A typical liberal effort, quoting Ayahs of the HOLY QURAN out of their context.
“But that wrong action by the govt. doesn’t make the action of these clerics any more righteous. Killing other muslims, destroying govt. property and endangering the lives of innocent people is not part of the Islam that I follow.”
@DL: Its not part of the Islam that I follow too, but still the state is killing their fellow Muslims, destroying their property and endangering lives of innocent people.
@ JWH; Kia karain, Allah only had so much space to address idiots like these in one Ayaah. And one Ayaah is only good for me. Read the Quran and then tell me if it’s out of context or not. Thanks.
The Lal Masjid terrorists have shown no respect for children and women (the students of Mullah Rasheed) by making them hostages and pawn to their nefarious personal agenda. What religion teaches and justifies this criminal and inhumane act? A religion is a source of humanity and peace. The actions of Mulla Rasheed are proving otherwise; you can expect such obduracy and disregard for humanity from a cult leader, not from a man of cloth.
If they are not terrorists, what they had to fear in surrendering to the State? People worldwide expect higher ethical standards from clergy of every faith, including Islam. Our clergy embarrassing for honest hardworking Muslims never lets go an opportunity to stoop lower and lower when it comes to ethics, morality and humanity is concerned. Nobody can match their pugnacious and deceitful mullahs in tarnishing the name of religion. They are stigma to Islam.
These mullahs kidnap civilians and policemen alike; they armed with illegal weapons; fire indiscriminately at all and sundry, make children and women hostages and human shields, use a place of prayer for criminal and terrorist activities; spew hatred; indoctrinate the impressionable with their evil ideology; abuse religion for personal designs; play god with the lives of the innocent; - to list a few of the crimes of these terrorists.
“@PHIL AHH… A typical liberal effort, quoting Ayahs of the HOLY QURAN out of their context.”
Strange. I always thought that that hardliner fanatics were the ones quoting Ayahs out of context.
if there were hostages being held against their will then so far how many hostages have been harmed by men inside the compound according to independent media? NONE so far.. only news comming out is from ISPR otherwise its a total news blackout… talks last night had almost succeeded according to Mufti-e-Azam Pakistan and other ulemas present but when shujat and company came back from President house they had messed up things, on one hand they were saying that Rasheed Ghazi will be sent to his home town in Rajanpur whereas shortly after that they changed their stance and started saying that Rasheed Ghazi would
be arrested and talks are over… these negotiators them selves were confused and didn’t had much power..
Man this Hamid guy needs some anger therapy.
Btw what are you doing in the country which you hate so much ?
A religious leader is the one who save humanity and human lives. A true and righteous follower (what to talk of a religious leader and a hardcore cleric) of any religions would have preferred to lay down his arms (would not have armed himself at first place) if it meant saving even a single life. No so when comes to the Lal Masjid Mulahs. If the acts of Mullah Rasheed and company are the true teachings of Islam, I am ashamed for this religion. If their very public acts were not Islamic, as any sensible person would say so, it is the responsibility of every Muslim to condemn these Mullahs who bring embarrassment to them and their religion.
blow up these bitches Ume Hassan and her daughter….fucking bitches endangered lifes of hundreds and came out safe. not acceptable
The tactics of the fanatic mullahs and mullees of Lal Masjid are not new. Their brothers in militancy played this drama before but most of them were sent to hell by brave French soldiers in 1979.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Mosque_Seizure
Queen bees.
i am staggered. i cant believe i follow the same religion that is followed by jehadi hate mongers on this website. perhaps time for a re-think.
btw these jehadis when they launch their suicide bombers and engage in sectarian killing show no mercy to us. i.e. awam. why is our government treating them with kid gloves? jehadis deserve the same treatment they dish out.
What I got from news is that last night they tried to lure women and children out so that they can start the operation but Ghazi refused and said they would all come out together.
The operation was inevitable after media publicly started calling the whole standoff a topi drama and diversion tactic by govt.
The seizure of the Kabbah is new information for me, and quite shocking at that. I hope we stop destroying the sanctity of the mosques in order to enforce our viewpoint upon others.
Kashid: “lure women and children” - It is something done by paedophile mullah predators; the government was trying to save their lives and in thr process lost brave soldiers.
@JAYJAY, RUTHLESS: I have serious doubts that you guys are even Muslims (no offense please), Kindly confirm so we can discuss the issue effectively.
@ king_faisal do let me know which religion you are going to switch to, I wan’t make sure I don’t end up in the same religion. I want to make sure I follow the religion that have no types of exteremists. :)
JWH
True to your mullah leaning, you have not lost a second in spewing out a fatwa and have challenged one’s religious beliefs. Is Mullah Rasheed a Muslim?
all i know is that my religion is different from that followed by jehadis. if their religion calls for the deliberate targetting of civilians, then my religion is not islam.
@RUTHLESS: Profaneness is a brutal vice. He who indulges in it is no gentleman. period!!
alhamdulilah i am a muslim but dont believe that kidnapping women at night from their homes or building mosques and madrassas on illegally occupied land, occupying libraries is Islam. Perhaps u are a student of this fascist mullah and came out in a burka with your Auntie Abdul Aziz and now venting anger on us and showing us that how true a muslim u are. my friend beauty of Islam lies in compassion and liniency not in empty rehtoric and forcing people in what u believe.
have a look at this article. its written for people like u and dont make judgements on others.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/miscellaneous/story/2007/07/070707_wajahat_column_sen.shtml
@Jayjay, Altaf is no longer muslim (again). As he forced AAmir liaquat out due to the reason that he favored the Fatwa issues against Rushdi.
@Ruthless, wat if u mother was among them?
This blog needs to be moderated i guess.
Musharraf has played a good game in showingthe USA that HE can only control the so called extremists. duH! he wont live for long like Zia
IUKNOWN: What Altaf, a terrorist, has to do with me? Keep your fatwas flowing by the way. Who is next?
IUNKNOWN: What Altaf, a terrorist, has to do with me? Keep your fatwas flowing by the way. Who is next?
RUTHLESS:- “Takfiris” are ideological masters of the Taliban and militant fanatics. No wonder they shoot fatwas outcasting everyone out of Islam, who does not conform to their ideology of hate, violence and narrow-mindedness.
@jayjay,
Is that ur Fatwa?
u seems a mullah as well. LoL
@JAYJAY: I sincerely apologize if you were offended, Its just that I haven’t seen this much anti-mullah sort of swearing before.
I am no mullah myself I don’t even have a beard, Its just that I offer my prayers under the leadership of an IMAM(leader) and I have great respect for them.
yes, religious and sectarian violence did not exist before mush. our mullahs were a civilised lot who solved problems through rational debate and discourese. all the secterian violence reported by pakistani-zionist media is myth. mush is playing a double game with us and the americans. he launches suicide attacks even against his own ministers and then cracks down on jehadis. mush is the personification of oo7 villan - a complete evil genius.
@IUnknown: if my mother would have been there i would have ended up on your side, man with his brain in Davy Johnes (this fascist mullah) locker.
There is only one answer to all these pseudo islamists, crush them ruthlessly: this is the only language they speak and only language they understand. Pakistan was not created by any dumb jihadi mullah by a barrage of sucide bombings, it was created by Quaid-e-Azam who never had to take law into his hands (was never imprisoned in his political life). if you are confident that what u are saying is right then why resort to terror and harassement? When did Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) has to kidnap people and harass them in order to make them accept that Islam is true religion?
Thanks, JWH:
I am no anti-Mullah, I am anti-jalhaliat which is repeatedly displayed by mullahs, tranishing the image of muslims. Anyway criticism of mullahs should not make anyone anti-Islam.
@Ruthless, who kidnapped ne body?
Do u think mullahs are cheap enough to to kidnapping?
Waza’ main tum Nasara ho, Tamaddun main Yahood…
Yeh musalman hain jinhain daikh kay sharmein Hanood!
@king_faisal sucide attacks and other attacks on Imambarghs (shia vs. sunnis )during B.Bhuttos and N.Sharifs reign were best examples of civilisation preached by these mullahs and a briliant example of rational debate and discourese for their descendants (fascist mullah). Tell me wasnt the father of this mullah also killed in his mosque by a rival faction way before musharraf even thought of comming into power.
Make some sense or are u also as much a rational as ur mullahs.
So many lives could have been saved but for the foolish stubbornness of two mullahs and their wives.
@IUnknown, either u r insane or suffering from memory loss.
look at the activites of lal mosque brigade over the last 6 months, recent addition was kidnapping of chinese and now their followers killed 3 chinese in peshawar.
..Main janta hoon us ka anjaam,
..Jis Markaay main Mullah ho Ghazi.
How true iqbal was really?
ruthless: i was being sarcastic although you put it much better than i did. jehadi problem has to be dealt with. shying away from confrontation wont solve anything. mercy is a concept completely alien to jehadis. they will cause mayhem independent of govt actions. sitting on the side lines wont solve anything.
The list of the kidnapped:
- Auntie Shameem, her daughter, daughter-in-law, and grand-daughter from their homes (4);
- Four policemen on duty(4);
- Two policemen on duty(2);
- Six policemen on duty(6);
- Six Chinese - Four women, two men - and three Pakistanis from an accupanture centre (9);
- Attempted kidnapping of several rangers, which resulted in the first shootout
25 kidnappings in all within three months - not bad for a group religious “students”
Must read, exposes the empty rehtoric of these mullahs and their blind followers who so easily can be tempted in the name of Islam:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/miscellaneous/story/2007/07/070707_wajahat_column_sen.shtml
..Koon kehta hai maut aayee to daar jaon ga
..Main to Mullah hoon Burkaay main nikal jaon ga
(Read in some other blog)
guys, Mush and Ghazi both are to blame.
Mush is playing with the life of our jawans, and Ghazi with that of innocent people.
Both are fighting personally.
Time will tell…
But one more thing,
I feel bad on the death of Ghazi’s mother. It has left me quite dumbstruck…
Ghazi’s surrender could have saved the lives of his mother and many others held hostage by the militants.
I agree with Zaki that Musharraf is also to blame — for being too lenient for too long.
Well this incident, I feel has brought a huge divide amongst liberals and fundamentalist. The gap has widened amongst different schools of thought.
The liberals as I can see are on their extreme, and their hatred for mullahs has for sure boosted, but on the other hand people like me which had a soft corner for fundamentalist are willing to go out and act on it, at least I feel this way.
My moral was first uplifted when CJ took a stand against the military leadership, but now after Mulana Ghazi’s stand its a whole new story. This is my personal analysis I wanted to share with you guys.
Thank you and ALLAH HAFIZ
MAY ALLAH BLESS US ALL
Jang website is down, overloaded with hits I think.
@king_faisal Sorry, I took it the other way
Maujizaat of Mullah Ghazi:
1. According to him they have only 14-15 rifles but amazingly those 14 rifles were not only used by 50 dead terrorists at the same time to fire on army jawans but are still being used by the rest of them. amazing considering that rifle has usually one trigger and in this materialistic world only one person can fire from one rifle,
2. ammunition of these highly sofisticated and “out of this world” rifles can act as potential petrol bombs, gernades and rocket launchers at the same time depending on the discretion of its user. we need to capture one of these rifles as it can be a deadly weopon in case we have to fight india or someone else
3. he has accomodated the brigade of 1800 “shaheeds” in his small basement hole as only around 50 “shaheeds” have managed to run away.
can anybody explain me why this fasicst mullah had accumulated such a hugh cache of weopons in his “Red Fort” if he is only preaching religion of peace (Islam) with his “peaceful tactics”?
Because the “14″ guns were being operated by highly “pious” men, they multiplied in numbers and intensity. Anyway, apart from the surrendering would-be-suicide-bombers, the rest of 1800 hiding in the basement behind the human shield are all ‘angels’ there to help a wali-ullah. Only that the military does not know that.
@JWH: what has CJ stand to do with this extremism. I didnt know that CJ was fighting for rule of Lal Masjid?
As i understand u are basically against musharraf and u are just looking for ways of getting rid of him. I also dont like him for reasons but we shall be discussing principles rather personalities. and in principle, fascist mullah is wrong for his fascism we have discussed above and musharraf is wrong for his unwillingness for democracy. dont bind urself with a person’s ldeology.
Best case, Pakistan shall be a democratic country with freedom for everyone and I mean everyone. not any bureaucracy or theocracy or military and I am also ready to fight for this principle.
@ruthless, do u think its possible widh out the
support of agencies??
Be honest, as it was all happening in capital.
right under the nose of govt.
Aye musalman, apnay dil say pooch. mulla say na pooch…. Ho gia ALLAH kay bandon say q khali Haram
Chill out guys. Jo hona thaa wo Khuda ki marzi say he howa, samjho. Buraa bhala, sub main behtari hoti hai. Just pray to go it all ends well for all of us. Ameen.
Zulm pir zulm hai, barhta hai toa mit jata hai… kion?
@IUnknown:
Lets for the sake of argument we assume that this is being done by the support of agencies (I dont support any military, agencies or whatever as i said earlier Democratic Pakistan free from theocracy or military influence).
son now what? does this absolve us of our duty to save ourselves from this kind of mindless fanaticism we see in these jihadis all over the world (Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and etc. - muslims killing each other in the name of Islam & forcing people to believe what they believe in). Why do people get so emotional whenever someone uses name of Islam.
for a moment, think how Islam and Pakistan has been defamed by this whole episode? Did Sir Syed Ahmed Khan, Allama Iqbal, QeD also adopted to this ideology to win us freedom. here is a point, when a mullah tries to take law into his hands and is trying to force his ideology by using his half literate emotional followers and we dont even have the courage or sense to oppose this. since when muslims resorted to these methods.
I was reading history of Bu Ali Sina and I read that he somewhere wrote in one of his books that Physical resurrection is not possible (what we believe will happen on day of judgement). did we read somewhere that some fanatics attacked him and cremated him alive for saying this. No. Because this was his point of view, and many Ulemas rejected it included Imam Ghizali. But no harassment and kidnapping by any fidayeen and you can see contributions of Bu Ali Sina to modern medical. similarly we also need to be more open, more rational in thinking and debate issue rather tha force which unfortunely is the way of these mullahs who are always ready to show their machismo.
I read on BBC.com also that Ume Hassan and her daughter surrendered and are now in custody. Till yesterday she was alonside mullah rasheed and was defiant that they will fight till death and rejected her husbands request to lay down arms and here she is saving her life like her husband.
I ask those who support these mullahs, where do they stand now?. if they are people of agencies then what? why are we supporting them? and u will see after some time these mullah brigade will start their rehtoric again and play with the lifes of innocent poor children in the name of jihad. Why did Adbul Aziz and Ume Hassan came out so shamelessly and do they deserve any respect? but no you will see that next time again some of us will be great followers of them or people like them and will forget all this what is hapening?
ruthless, you are doing a great job along with a lot of other people here. we need to act in the same manner outside of cyberspace as well.
KING-FAISAL: I agree that rational voices need to be heard. No more giving into obscurantists.
The expression on the old man’s face waiting for his son, who is still inside makes one’s heart bleed. May his son come out alive.
Zulm pir zulm hai, barhta hai toa mit jata hai… kion?
Sahe kaha! musharraf ko bilakhir ek din mitna hee hay par shayed uswaqt tak boht der hojayee *sigh*
@ruthless: preaching starts from home. First bring openness and rational thinking in yourself then preach others. Your comments just reflect that you are a left wing mullah.
@Adnan Siddiqi: well said. if u dont buy my argument, no problem. but base ur allegations on facts. i gave my facts (from medival history of islam- if u need any more references you can ask-and our recent history as well) for why shall we not blindly follow mad rehtoric, give ur arguments. passing judgment of “left wing mullah” without any supportive argument make u look like ____?
Hameed, any chance you can get to lal masjid now so you can join the jihadis in hell? Thanks in anticipation.
as an example you can list the achievements of mullahs like Ghazi brothers from Pakistan’s history. That can be a good starting point for your list of arguments.
as an example you can list the “achievements” of mullahs like Ghazi brothers from Pakistan’s history. That can be a good starting point for your list of arguments.
News are that Operation Silence is almost ended and formal announcement will be made shortly. No sign of Ghazi or his immediate family yet.
@ruthless, u dont know wats happening inside. There is no proper coverage going on . Only army is telling us what we know. i know there must have been a lot more casualities than wat have been told to us.
So wat mullah has to do with muslim killing muslim. Did ARG started that? If yess then how?
How did ammunition got there in masjid in capital ? Was ISI sleeping at that moment?
Why did the rangers go away few weeks ago from Lal Masjid? Why didnt they catch any one when the ppl burnt the CDs in the market?
Referring to Bu Ali Sina, there wasnt that rubbish from Govt. at that time. That was the discussion between Ulmas. Do u think Pervaiz to be a scholar?
And more over, where is ARG now??????????
jayjay, i think you will see a lot of people speaking against the jehadi mindset. until the lal masjid crackdown, it was pointless to speak out against jehadis because jehadis had carte blanche from the state. now however jehadi tide has turned. jehadi response will likely be violent but i hope that govt will respond in kind and with force 10x greater. the lives of our jawan lost in the lal masjid operation would be in vain if the things go back to normal. remember the mudererer of punjabi woman minister had killed women before but got out because of jehadi support.
Ghazi Abdul Rasheed Dies - Interior Ministry
it would have been better if ghazi had lived. his detention would have been an example to others. now jehadis will turn him into a martyr.
Good words Ruthless and King Faisal! I think the time has really come to stop pussy footing around and grab the bull by the horns (or the mullah by the beard in this case).
They should make an example of these two idiot brothers and give them the noose within a month. When the fundoos get up to protest, grab a few of them and chuck them into jail and maybe hang a few of that lot too. Then, with the momentum that has been gained, finally finish off the work that no previous government has had the balls to do. Abolish the blasphemy laws, bulldoze every single illegal mosque and madrassa (or make it Shaheed, as it is so cutely put in the media these days) and reform the educational system to erase all overt mentions of religion. Only by raising